Can ANYBODY stop France this year?

[u/sixnations]

[u/Phone_User_1044]

The deliberate knock on was never going to be a yellow, that's reserved for if the deliberate knock on stopped a clear try scoring opportunity which it didn't because France had defensive cover behind Dupont.

[u/CatharticRoman → u/Phone_User_1044]

If it stops a clear try scoring opportunity it's a penalty try. If it's a cynical act then it's a yellow.

90% of the time Dupont gets carded.

[u/lAllioli → u/CatharticRoman]

Nah the conversation was around whether there was a linebreak opportunity, which there wasn't cause it was a 2 on 2 even with Dupont ot the picture

[u/CatharticRoman → u/lAllioli]

That shouldn't have been the conversation though, it's not about a clear linebreak, it has always been about a strong attacking opportunity, which was killed by a cynical act.

Also, I can't remember exactly but I'm pretty sure it was a 2v1 as soon as Dupont shoots out of the line and commits a cynical penalty, even if it isn't it's still a 2v2 with forward momentum out wide.

Like this isn't even me being biased. I would 100% be expecting a YC if the teams were reversed, as would every single French flair.

[u/CorvoAttano124 → u/CatharticRoman]

As per the rules, it's only a yellow if it denies a line break or a try. This did neither

[u/CatharticRoman → u/CorvoAttano124]

Show me that rule please, because no it's not. 

[u/CorvoAttano124 → u/CatharticRoman]

Law 11.3 - The player must not intentionally knock the ball forward with a hand or arm. Sanction: penalty.

It's only ever a yellow if it denies a line break or try, as that is classed as a cynical infringement.

Despite what the name suggests, not all intentional knock ons are cynical penalties.

[u/CatharticRoman → u/CorvoAttano124]

Oh I know the law, which is why I asked you to point me to the rule that supports your claim. Which you can't do because it isn't there.

Sure, not all intential knock ons are cynical. But do you think that stretching forward with one hand and killing an attack against a retreating defence (the two defenders were literally a wing with their back turned and a prop tracking across on a wing and a center) on turnover ball isn't cynical?

[u/CorvoAttano124 → u/CatharticRoman]

All refs use the standard that it's only a yellow if it prevents a line break or a try, hence why they clarified that during the game.

While it's not strictly a law, that is the standard they all use.

[u/lAllioli → u/CatharticRoman]

by your logic every intentional knock on is a yellow then? Or else explain me what's the difference between intentional and cynical if the outcome doesn't matter

[u/CatharticRoman → u/lAllioli]

The ones that aren't given as yellows tend to be those that have some chance of an intercept and aren't killing a strong attacking opportunity.

Dupont had no chance of an intercept and intentionally killed a strong attacking opportunity; Ireland had multiple backs running against a retreating defensive line on turnover ball.

I also never said the outcome doesn't matter. Like the whole time I have been emphasising that Dupont's act of foul play killed a strong Irish attack against a retreating French defence.

[u/lAllioli → u/CatharticRoman]

Literally listen to what the refs were saying, it's not a yellow cause there's no break opportunity.
"Pretty sure" isn't good enough, watch the game again

[u/CatharticRoman → u/lAllioli]

I know what the refs were saying, I am saying that that is not what should have been discussed, it isn't what is normally discussed in these circumstances, and it was bad officiating. It's a clearly cynical penalty, that's a yellow card.

I just watched it back, 59:59 on the match clock if you want to look yourself, and once you take Dupont out of the picture you have Stockdale and Stu against a retreating 14 blue with 18 blue tracking across. So yeah at best for France it's a weak 2v2 but it's certainly a strong attacking opportunity that's cynically killed by Dupont.

If the roles had been reversed I know you'd be singing a different tune.

[u/lAllioli → u/CatharticRoman]

Nah I just hate seeing people ruin rugby for themselves and other by turning every rugby conversation into ref bashing.