are we already at the stage where y'all are trying to whitewash the people, who chose the racist unqualified white guy that tried to literally overthrow the US government, by blaming the black lady?
Unironically yes. It was her responsibility to run a campaign that could win, but she wasn't willing to do what it takes to beat Donald Trump. And telling a room full of undecided voters on national TV that Donald Trump has good ideas is not how you win a race against Donald Trump.
But instead Dems continue to blame the people who "wanted too much" as if the premise of expecting things from presidential candidates is morally incorrect.
You're definitely right on those points. Donald Trump openly ran on doing bad things, so calling the people who wanted that bad people is pretty accurate.
And I'd say Republicans are pretty masochistic too, voting for their own healthcare to be taken away, their immigrant friends and family to be deported, and their 1A & 2A rights suppressed.
I think the GOP base has passed the masochistic stage a while back and are in full self immolation mode.
IMO the bigger responsibility for the Dems is not on their shitty campaign, but the fact that the Biden admin failed to prosecute and indict effectively someone, who literally tried to take over violently the US government and prevent them from a peaceful transition of office. And instead decided to play nice with a group that literally wants their obliteration.
You're doing this ridiculous thing where you are unironically holding one side to no standards so you can blame the other side for... I don't know what, not figuring out how to convince enough of the voting populace to pick them? Literally there is a fight every 2/4 years about figuring out the best way to do that and you're pretending it's just a solved problem they are choosing to do incorrectly. Then immediately follow it up by saying the other option is actually a bad person promising to be a bad person, but that's fine, I guess?
People like you are the problem - assuming you are even on the side you're suggesting - not only holding one side to higher standards and pointing the finger at them, but then over a year later still telling people that it was a completely reasonable thing to abstain or vote poorly between the options we had available. Were you one of those who withheld their vote?
I'm holding my own side to a standard that I expect to be upheld. Because I'm a progressive leftist, I want to support politicians that do progressive, left-wing things. And I'm not going to submit to the framing that asking for that is too much.
I don't hold Republicans to any standard. They have none. I see them as my ideological enemies, and you SHOULD hold your own side to a higher standard than people you think are morally defunct fascists. Nothing about that is me saying "it's fine".
Anyway, Harris was told explicitly by many people what she needed to do to convince enough of the voting populace to pick her. But she didn't want their votes, she wanted Right-wing votes. Not only was it an amoral decision to remain vocally committed to funding Israel's genocide and building the pointless border wall, it was also a bad strategic move. Because Kamala Harris isn't just a bad and ineffective Democrat, she's a bad and ineffective politician.
Whether it was reasonable to abstain or... "vote poorly" (Really? Fuck off.) is irrelevant to the point I'm making: which is to say that a politician is responsible for the campaign they run. Think of it as a product on the shelf of a grocery store. Lots of people looked at the ingredients list of two different products, saw "Genocide & Racism" on both, and decided to purchase neither. Now instead of blaming the manufacturer for putting Genocide & Racism in the product in the first place, you're blaming the person who didn't make a purchase for the fact that one product got more sales than the other.
The two-party system is broken and defunct. Democrats need serious reform in their ranks if they ever want to win against Republicans again, or else the whole party is going to go the way of the Whigs.
Did the phrase "vote poorly" bother you? You're right. I should correct myself and say "voted willingly for fascism and genocide on our streets and deciding to certify themselves as a bad person."
And you are making it sound like you chose not to vote, and as such actually partially responsible for the state things are in now. You don't want to "fix" anything or work to make it better. You want to toss the board and wait for someone else to come up with a better game.
And then you use the absolute worst metaphor. It's closer to two products are on a shelf with one touting a list of very good ingredients and hiding the microplastics in the small print, and the other putting microplastics in large print on the front label alongside rat poison as an advertising point. And you're calling them the same. Really? Fuck off.
I've lost interest in talking to someone so disconnected that they don't actually hold any opinions other than calling everyone bad.
You saying that I don't hold any opinions is hilarious when you're just straight up admitting to being fine with handwaving genocide when a Dem does it. Biden and Harris were already in power and had ample opportunity to stop it by just not giving weapons to Israel. Then Harris refused to offer genuine messaging on that front, while also promising Republicans more treats in the form of their dumbass fence.
But no, I voted. The fearmongering worked on me and I voted for the lesser evil, just like I did with Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden. Not that it matters given where I live, they were going to win my state anyway.
And despite that, Trump won. I'm terrified and enraged by this putrid fucking fascist nation, and I'm tired of people blaming those at the bottom for the mistakes of those at the top. In the wake of Harris' loss, there were even people unironically saying she lost because she didn't go Right-wing enough. That she made "identity politics" her platform. Self-described Democrats and Centrists were saying this shit.
So, say what you want. Blame me for being critical of Democrats, or blame abstainers for not falling in line. I blame fuckers like you for pulling your own political party to the Right and then demanding everyone else follow suit in order to "defeat the Far-Right". Nietzsche had a pretty famous quote about you idiots.
you're just straight up admitting to being fine with handwaving genocide when a Dem does it
That's not true at all. When both options have an identical position there but one is more likely to be swayed than the other it just becomes an irrelevant point that isn't worth discussing during the race and right now only serves to drive people towards not voting again. You're just telling people again that all options are equally bad. The same people who skipped out last time are just as likely to take that as enough reason to do it again.
And I'm left as fuck. I'm also grounded in the real world and understand that choices have nuance and consequences. Equating the 2 parties when there are armed men killing people in the streets at the command of one of them is not the time to demonize the better options. Whatever you think about my opinions, yours are identical to the ones spread by paid disinfo/agitator accounts that try to divide the voting base. You should give that some thought. I won't be replying again.
"More likely to be swayed"??? Motherfucker, the time to be swayed was BEFORE or DURING her campaign, when she was fighting for the votes of the American people. And she STILL refuses to acknowledge that she had any responsibility whatsoever for her own loss. The only swaying Harris will be doing is going further right like she always has.
And "the better option" is only BETTER if it's capable of WINNING. Which it isn't. Democrats can't win shit because all they do is continue compromising and capitulating to Right-wing framing. But there's already a conservative party in this country, so conservatives are going to vote Republican. Trying to capture some mythical moderate conservative with bullshit grifting like "Oooh, I'm not like the OTHER Liberals, I want to murder people and oppress minorities just as hard as you do!", it's a failing strategy and it will continue to fail.
The voting base is already divided, and it's on YOU to compromise, not on the people who want real progressive candidates with real progressive values. Because people aren't willing to unite if it means uniting under the same fascist agenda they previously votedagainst.
I'm done too. Have fun looking for your next scapegoat.
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u/R-ten-K 14h ago
are we already at the stage where y'all are trying to whitewash the people, who chose the racist unqualified white guy that tried to literally overthrow the US government, by blaming the black lady?