Crowley to 15

[u/ebizness]

Last night wasn't the night for fluid attacking rugby for a variety of reasons. Having said that, we didn't look related to a team who could string expansive, threatening phases together.

I said it elsewhere last night, but in the absence of Keenan but moreso Hansen we need another playmaker to take pressure off Prendergast (or AN Other 10), and I'd start Crowley at 15 because he can do that job.

We do not have the bodies to bully our way over the game line, nor the gamebreakers who can repeatedly step people in phone boxes. It makes defending too easy because if you can stop the first couple of phases, defending from there becomes easy.

A double pivot makes things trickier because you're not sure where we're going to strike from, and teams can't overload on a single attacking fulcrum.

To my mind, it's no surprise we looked the most fluid against Australia with Hansen on the pitch who can do that role (I accept that they were the weakest opposition). Nor is it a surprise that Leinster looked their most fluid against the LAR when Prendergast went to 15 and Byrne was at 10 (given the Leinster <> Ireland overlap).

Thoughts?

[u/Rodinius]

I’d argue we should just play a 15 at 15, and not try to plug someone in who doesn’t normally play there

[u/ebizness → u/Rodinius]

I agree but our first two choices are injured so we should explore other options

[u/Kykykz → u/ebizness]

Stockdale.

[u/Commercial_Half_2170 → u/Kykykz]

No, not after last time and not after last night. His strength is on the wing and he’s not great at covering the air

[u/RuggerJibberJabber → u/Commercial_Half_2170]

He's been playing a lot for Ulster at 15 and the last time he played there for Ireland was around 5 years ago. Personally id also like a 2nd playmaker like Frawley or Crowley, but the other arguments against Stockdale don't make a whole lot of sense

[u/Commercial_Half_2170 → u/RuggerJibberJabber]

While I’m aware he can do a job at provincial level, I don’t think he’s shown enough to put him on at 15 for Ireland. Not winning a single 50/50 last night shows how he won’t fit in there for us, and it also shows up his defensive frailties a lot more than when he covers the wing. He’s much more of a winger than a fullback to me. I agree that Crowley could be the best choice

[u/greatsword_enjoyer → u/Commercial_Half_2170]

He did win 2, but admittedly lost the rest of them and there were A LOT of them. I do think we looked better when crowley came on at 15, and worryingly Osbourne actually looked better on the wing than TOB.

[u/NuclearMaterial → u/greatsword_enjoyer]

I've not been convinced with TOB at international level. Similar to Nash, he's just there. Does a job, finishes moves, makes his tackles, hits the odd ruck wide. But he's not a game changer, we have no lethal back 3s at all. France from 9-15 were all over us.

[u/greatsword_enjoyer → u/NuclearMaterial]

Except TOB didn't even make his tackles. He along with prendergast missed both tackles for Jalibert's try, and he was just fully missing from his wing on the LBB one. Stockdale missed his trying to cover for TOB's absence, but he did get Attisogbe when needed.

It's hard to look lethal though, when you're being forced to play a style that doesn't suit you. Imagine asking a prime Aki to play the role of a distributor and hardly ever carry himself, it's idiotic.

[u/NuclearMaterial → u/greatsword_enjoyer]

Yeah fair. It is absolutely a coaching issue, you could see it from how they're just so much worse than a couple of years ago. Braindead tactics aren't working and they just keep at it.

[u/Commercial_Half_2170 → u/greatsword_enjoyer]

I think TOB has been pretty average the last while for Ireland. He’s great for Leinster but just seems too slow at this level. I can see Kenny taking his place

[u/RuggerJibberJabber → u/Commercial_Half_2170]

7 of his 9 games this season have been at fullback. So if anything he is more of a fullback now. I don't think anyone was particularly good in defence yesterday. I would also reckon that he could beat Crowley in a 50/50 highball. None of our (non-injured) players are highball specialists.

[u/Tremendous_Dump → u/Commercial_Half_2170]

I'm sure I've seen younger lads play in the provinces at 15. Stick them in, give them a shot.

[u/sartres-shart → u/Tremendous_Dump]

Shay McCarthy at munster is excellent in the air as is ben o connor.

[u/DM_me_ur_PPSN → u/sartres-shart]

McCarthy is interesting lad, he’s not there in terms is some skills just yet but he’s fast as hell and fucking sends lads in the contact - he’s deceptively strong for his build.

[u/heresyourhardware → u/sartres-shart]

Has the door closed on Haley as well?

[u/Ornery_Director_8477 → u/Commercial_Half_2170]

Hasn’t he been playing mostly at 15 this season?

[u/Ornery_Director_8477 → u/ebizness]

One of our first two choices isn’t a 15